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Old 05-13-2008, 07:35 AM
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Who Was Created first?

Did men really come first,or vice versa?
The gender question here
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Old 05-13-2008, 09:23 AM
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I like the bible version its kinda romantic ........Man was created first!!

His scientific findings are shocking though !!
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Old 05-13-2008, 09:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Obariba View Post
I like the bible version its kinda romantic ........Man was created first!!

His scientific findings are shocking though !!
Does one even have to get scientific?How about using simple reasoning and common sense?Like men come out of women by birth,and not vice versa.And since that is the case,the female gender has to have come first to be able to give birth to the male gender.Biology simply confirms that.
Given how horrendous the various translations of the bible were over the centuries,i will not be surprised if that book never said that the male was created first,but was miquoted by incompetent translators.
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Old 05-13-2008, 09:44 AM
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Originally Posted by vince View Post
Does one even have to get scientific?How about using simple reasoning and common sense?Like men come out of women by birth,and not vice versa.And since that is the case,the female gender has to have come first to be able to give birth to the male gender.Biology simply confirms that.
Given how horrendous the various translations of the bible were over the centuries,i will not be surprised if that book never said that the male was created first,but was miquoted by incompetent translators.


But we know someone has to put the baby in the womb ...and Im certain it was not another female homosapian ..... so indeed there had to be a male specie.

Similar to the question ...who came first ..The Chicken or the egg !!
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Old 05-13-2008, 09:47 AM
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But we know someone has to put the baby in the womb
True that.How about by divine insemination?The buck has got to start from somewhere?Lol!
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Old 05-13-2008, 09:52 AM
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True that.How about by divine insemination?The buck has got to start from somewhere?Lol!

Well its happened b4 ...Immaculate Conception
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Old 05-13-2008, 09:57 AM
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Well the bible does say in the creation story part 1 that the male and female were created at the same time(which would make the most sense),before throwing in a clanger by saying in creation story part 2 that EVE was created from the rib of ADAM.Sometimes,i get the feeling that that book deliberately toys with people's heads.
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Old 05-13-2008, 10:11 AM
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Well the bible does say in the creation story part 1 that the male and female were created at the same time(which would make the most sense),before throwing in a clanger by saying in creation story part 2 that EVE was removed from the ribs of ADAM.Sometimes,i get the feeling that that book deliberately toys with people's heads.
I agree cos every other specie was created with a partner ... ..no body parts were used to recreate the female versions of the animals.

Maybe the energy source indeed chose to create homosapians a little different or added a creative twist to its female creation.

Im thinking since we are made in the image of energy source ....it means energy source is alone and does not need a partner...this is what distinguishes energy source from the rest of us co-creators.

Why did Energy source think man was lonely and needed a partner ?
Is the lonliness created because other beings/animals had a mate ?
I guess man needed a woman due to the environment in which he was placed ...if he was placed in a different space which did not have animals with partners then maybe a companion would not be required.

Does this mean if I want to indeed rise above others I might need to stand alone and distance myself from having a mate.Would that give me more creative powers ?

Is this why the Catholic church does not allow the Reverend fathers marry ?
Maybe that is why they can listen to confession and forgive sins !

Last edited by Obariba; 05-13-2008 at 10:17 AM.
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Old 05-13-2008, 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Obariba
Im thinking since we are made in the image of energy source ....it means energy source is alone and does not need a partner...this is what distinguishes energy source from the rest of us co-creators.
I find it difficult to follow that the "energy source"(by that you probably mean the creator God) created humans in it's image,because as a energy source,it can't be corporeal,but rather ethereal,since it is a spirit,and since it is a spirit,it can't have an image to mold us after, because it is supposed to be formless.
This is another one of those instances where the bible seems to be toying with it's readers heads,yet again.
How can a non-corporeal being mold a physical being(man) in it's own image when it has none?
Anyway,i think pairing beings of two different genders in the physical world comes out of necessity under the influence of nature's laws that exist in the physical world,and has little in common with what exist in the non physical world.I am only speculating,ofcourse.Who knows anything about the unknowable.But it is fun to speculate,isn't it.
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Old 05-13-2008, 11:04 AM
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I find it difficult to follow that the "energy source"(by that you probably mean the creator God) created humans in it's image,because as a energy source,it can't be corporeal,but rather ethereal,since it is a spirit,and since it is a spirit,it can't have an image to mold us after, because it is supposed to be formless.
This is another one of those instances where the bible seems to be toying with it's readers heads,yet again.
How can a non-corporeal being mold a physical being(man) in it's own image when it has none?
Anyway,i think pairing beings of two different genders in the physical world comes out of necessity under the influence of nature's laws that exist in the physical world,and has little in common with what exist in the non physical world.I am only speculating,ofcourse.Who knows anything about the unknowable.But it is fun to speculate,isn't it.

Vince do u know what the bible has in common with many other world belief systems ??
They all agree on one thing ....man was created in the image of its creative source !
That is what I learnt from the documentay "The Secret"
It is not only the bible that inspires that message other religions or spiritual paths agree that we are a duplicate of our creative source !

So Im thinking according to ur response ..if I am removed from a non physical world I would not need a partner ...if I want to be "corporeal" ?. Its beginning to sound like the male partner is only there to procreate ...hmmm .... is this why Obafemi Awolowo I heard only had sex with his wife only when he wanted to make babies ? (I read his memoir)

If one abstains from sex like the monks etc ...would that indeed heighten your level of consciousness/spirituality or creative ability ?
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Old 05-13-2008, 11:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Obariba
Vince do u know what the bible has in common with many other world belief systems ??
They all agree on one thing ....man was created in the image of its creative source !
That is what I learnt from the documentay "The Secret"
The only way to make any sense of that is to assume that that "creative source" is corporeal,meaning that it is physical,it has a body,it is non spiritual.If that is the case,then humans were created by beings as physical as we are,and that is exactly what world mythologies state quite clearly and the bible implies that as well.
Were humans created by physical beings?The bible seems to say quite loudly,YES.By the first creation story by that verse that says,"Let US create man in our IMAGE".This would imply that whoever they were that wanted to create,had image,hence form,hence were corporeal,hence were physical beings.
Other world creation myths go along the same line, as well."Star beings came from above and create man",so they all say.
Can physical beings create another physical being?We all know now,with the advancement of science in successfully mapping out the human genome,and in cloning, that the answer to that is a resounding YES.It is just a matter of time before humans start creating physical human bodies.
"Let US create man in our IMAGE".That sounds more like coming from scientists with advanced knowledge of genetic engineering ready to clone,innit?Were the ELOHIM scientists?There are some folks in some areas who are saying that they were.
Now if this is correct,then i would expect females to be part of that scientist team,which would then explain why male and female were created at the same time in the creation story version 1 of genesis.
As for whether partners are needed in the spiritual realm,or whether staying celebate can help speed up attainment of higher spiritual consciousness,i don't know.Anything is possible
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Old 05-13-2008, 11:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vince View Post
True that.How about by divine insemination?The buck has got to start from somewhere?Lol!
Vince you will be alright after you done confusing yourself. First, it was unreasonable for man to be first because of biology, now you rest your case on some divine insemination... insemination by God or monkeys??

God created everything in two so they can re-incarnate except human. God didn't decide to create woman until he found out that it will be inappropriate to tag Adam with any other animal no matter what the closest proximity of their resemblance. As a matter of fact, God was looking for help mate, someone to keep Adam amused, happy and assist and also will be able to procreate. Since all other creatures already got their specific resemblance in male and female, he decided to do same thing for man.

The major reason a woman was created is for Adam not to be alone, meaning not to be the only human living on earth. And its clear that Adam can't have baby by himself. I'm sure God would have created another man with Adam if not for procreation and God doesn't want to be creating human from the sand all the time. But thank God, He made some features appear on woman that kept the man amused forever. Even though dem women are trips.
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Old 05-13-2008, 11:55 AM
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Originally Posted by vince View Post
I find it difficult to follow that the "energy source"(by that you probably mean the creator God) created humans in it's image,because as a energy source,it can't be corporeal,but rather ethereal,since it is a spirit,and since it is a spirit,it can't have an image to mold us after, because it is supposed to be formless.
This is another one of those instances where the bible seems to be toying with it's readers heads,yet again.
How can a non-corporeal being mold a physical being(man) in it's own image when it has none?
Anyway,i think pairing beings of two different genders in the physical world comes out of necessity under the influence of nature's laws that exist in the physical world,and has little in common with what exist in the non physical world.I am only speculating,ofcourse.Who knows anything about the unknowable.But it is fun to speculate,isn't it.
I don't think that image should be interpreted as something physical but rather abstract. What makes man so similar to God? I don't think the answer is his form but rather his identity as a person. What makes us people if not the ability to think and make decisions? I once studied this theme of resemblance in the xtian phylosophy and the teacher explained that God did creat men in his own image as in he gave him a coscience of his own just like the Creator. He can invent and create just like his Creator. Who knows God might have created men to be free and have no bonds with him because I find it difficult to think that as an omniscent being he would give his creation all these qualities and expect him to remain under his almighty care.
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Old 05-13-2008, 12:19 PM
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I don't think that image should be interpreted as something physical but rather abstract. What makes man so similar to God? I don't think the answer is his form but rather his identity as a person. What makes us people if not the ability to think and make decisions? I once studied this theme of resemblance in the xtian phylosophy and the teacher explained that God did creat men in his own image as in he gave him a coscience of his own just like the Creator. He can invent and create just like his Creator. Who knows God might have created men to be free and have no bonds with him because I find it difficult to think that as an omniscent being he would give his creation all these qualities and expect him to remain under his almighty care.
That is always the problem with the unknowable,isn't it?It is always a matter of interpretation.What you wrote there is another form of interpretation that might or might not be accurate.
Welcome to the conjectureland.
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Old 05-13-2008, 12:22 PM
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Vince you will be alright after you done confusing yourself. First, it was unreasonable for man to be first because of biology, now you rest your case on some divine insemination... insemination by God or monkeys??

God created everything in two so they can re-incarnate except human. God didn't decide to create woman until he found out that it will be inappropriate to tag Adam with any other animal no matter what the closest proximity of their resemblance. As a matter of fact, God was looking for help mate, someone to keep Adam amused, happy and assist and also will be able to procreate. Since all other creatures already got their specific resemblance in male and female, he decided to do same thing for man.

The major reason a woman was created is for Adam not to be alone, meaning not to be the only human living on earth. And its clear that Adam can't have baby by himself. I'm sure God would have created another man with Adam if not for procreation and God doesn't want to be creating human from the sand all the time. But thank God, He made some features appear on woman that kept the man amused forever. Even though dem women are trips.
Mr absolute certainty,se you don land.Your own is just to draw verbatim from what you read from the biblical texts even if they don't make much sense.
I can't possibly confuse myself because i am not claiming absolute certainty her,but just merely speculating on what might have happened.
I don't project the impression that i know aboslutely(like you do),and i definitely do not believe that anybody else does.
Besides,you only based your post on the creation story version 2.What about the very first version,where it is written that man and woman were created at the same time?
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