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Discussion in 'AFRICAN MOVIES, TV & WEB SHOWS' started by Kala Lou, Jun 24, 2012.
I'm enjoying the topic!
Obviously the show is about AIDS awareness, something they've been drumming into our ears since I was a child 20 years ago. So I don't know what is African about having AIDS. Anyway, I've already talked about the story. But what I disagree on in your statement is the part where you wrote that it will take Nollywood long time to produce a quality series like that insinuating Kenya is ahead of Naija (speaking of brash statement o) of which I gave an example of a Naija soap opera called Tinsel and went ot to tell you, by using Nollywood's dominance, Kenyan movie industry cannot compare to Nollywood. This, my friend, is a fact not fallacy.
Most people do have an option so I don't understand your stance on movie access. People in my village have DSTV now and they can watch American movies, Chinese movies etc, but guess what they watch mostly outside football? YORUBA MAGIC/AFRICAN MAGIC. Majority are really not interested in Tutsi or Hotel Rwanda (which btw didn't get good review in Rwanda). They want their Police Baby, Blood Sister, Black Berry Babes, Jenifa, Ile Alayo just to mention a few.
It is not a brash statement when I mention the fact that Nollywood is numero uno in Africa. You have to understand the business economy in Naija. In fact you have to understand the basic economics before you can point fingers at the producers. The law of supply and demand in its simplistic form is really what is driving Nollywood. You mention Afolanyan, and I say kudos to him. He is taking the risk his father took back in the day. But don't forget how long it took Figuerine to come on DVD -I think it took three years. Don't forget about financial part of the production. How to get the bank to fund your movies? Who is going to fund it? These are challenges that producers face. Not too long ago we read about how one executive producer was in a tussle with the director over money/right issue. You tink say e easy? E no easy.
Just saw a few episodes of Tinsel on the big tube. While the series is good, it is not Shuga good. Tinsel is high on production value, no doubt, but from what i have seen so far, it isn't up there with Shuga, in my view.
You raise very good points and I like the one above because the simple truth is 'Nollywood' is a drug to many and we are consumer junkies for it.
The 'dealer' (producers) can sell 100% cocaine; we'll snort it. They can sell coke chopped up so 95% is dog poo and we'll still buy it as we are addicts. They found something that, no matter what we say, is VERY special to millions of people. 'Good' drugs, 'bad' drugs we might complain but we (addicts) HAVE to have that fix. Awesome!!
True but Shuga is not 'purely' Kenyan... it's American production values that made it what it is.
You may have noticed in various threads I don't regard SA films as 'African' because almost all their films are French, German, UK, Canada and so on collabos. Nollywood is more or less 'pure' African.
They are talking about aids awareness from an Africans perspective, good to know that you are already aware but there are people out there who are not, I think that is their target audience. The thing is that I don't care who produced the story, be it Americans or Chinese, what I care about is that they are able to show lives of everyday Africans with a high production value. I've never been to Nairobi but with what I've seen from Shuga, I feel like I have "some" idea of what life is like over there. The movie or show doesn't have to be total crap for us to accept as our own.
Kolinzo and Kala Lou are from 2 different schools of thought, you are one that feels there's nothing wrong with the industry so let us just keep on trucking, I on the other hand feel that the production has to improve drastically to sustain the industry. If you watch the clip I started on another thread, Steph Okereke talks about how some Nolly producers are unwilling to make another movie because they have not recouped the money they spent from the last one. If this trend continues...where will Nolly be in another 10 years.
When I say people don't have options I'm talking about the Alaba type setting, I bet you won't find "Tsotsi" in the market, the market is flooded with pirated copies of bad Nolly flicks...the few that make good Nolly flicks are afraid to put their stuff out on DVD. People love to see people like themselves on the screen, so whatever is available that's what they will watch.
Naija might be number one in terms of quantity..but when it comes to quality..far from it.
Make we just de beat our chest..shouting that we are number one....put our head for sand...and not look to improve our industry. If to say Apple decided not to innovate(or steal) any new technology and they were still selling the original Mackintosh, which was a great computer in its time, you think say dem for be number 1 today?
The main thing is not who made them...but where they successful in trying to tell African Stories in a high quality format?
I am not amongst those hooked on that drug sha, VB. I "unhooked" myself a long long time ago and there were already folks who unhooked themselves even way before me. I want to see African stories told and packaged in high quality production values only, or else, i ain't interested.
The days of feeding fat on junk quality naija productions are long over for me and many other folks. I don't care whether the production is in english or in yoruba or any other indigenous naija language, just package it to me in a super high quality standard if you want me to watch it. The audience of nollywood need to really push these producers real hard to move them up to the next level.
Thank God that that has started in the industry with new producers coming out to make movies of much higher production standards than was normally available before.
Oh definitely a lot of 'us' are not on that drug and some never have been. I wrote 'we' as in general. I didn't want to write market woman or palmie drinker for village.
What is Shuga good? While Shuga is a mini series, Tinsel is a soap opera so different camera... shooting angle, the acting etc are different. But the production is still high.
If you think Kenyans by now don't know anything about AIDS then it means you haven't heard about the Atlantic bridge where you can drive from Nigeria to USA. Like I've said, when Hollywood is collaborating they do so to suite their own taste. Having AIDS is NOT an African story.
Nobody is saying you have to accept crap, but what I disagree on is that NOLLYWOOD WILL TAKE FOREVER TO GET TO SHUGA LEVEL. You wrote that, I didn't. That's the main reason I had to remind you who the big boy still is.
You have said it all with the Stephanie Okereke's interview, which btw buttresses the point I made on my previous quote of you -the "e no easy." Knowing this, then why are you blaming the industry for not being too trigger happy to shoot high quality movies? Anyway, that is not really a trend, that has been how Nigeria film industry works since inception. Back in the day people would make good movie and they would not make money. They would have to keep reshowing at the theatres for over 5 years. In fact some of the works from 25yrs ago are still not released yet because the producers are either dead or lost money...
As for movie access, please with all due respect, where did you grow up? I grew up in Ondo/Lagos states simultaneously,lol. While it might be true you may not find Tsotsi in Alaba market, I can guarantee you will find Bad Boyz I & II; I can guarantee you will find Avartar; I can guarantee you will find British Movies and series; in fact you will find most American, Chinese movies, Indian movies, Nollywood movies etc almost anywhere in Lagos, pirated copies of course. You may not find Tsotsi because they don't give a damn about Tsotsi -which is one my points- so even pirated copies of Tsotsi will be a loss for the pirate because nobody will buy it. They would rather watch Blood Sister before Tsotsi. So there is access but consumers want what they want. Put Sanyeri side by side with Adam Sandler and see who majority of Lagos consumers would choose.
The mistake we often make is comparing USA and Nigeria. We are not on the same level! USA has security, Nigeria does not. Therefore, while it is convinient to use Apple as an example of innovation, remember that there is a condusive enviroment that enables it. You can only face what is in front of you. What we are facing is not what Americans are facing. Bring the same Apple to Naija now and see if its innovation will not become that of computer village. Again, the fault is not the Producers' but the government who cannot create a condusive enviroment that enables innovation.
We all want the best for Nollywood. But we really can't succeed in this current Naija system. I'm glad for the new producers who are taking risks to produce high quality movies. Some of them will tell you, though, they barely breakeven after three years of showing their movies at cinemas. Is that really what we want? I mean do we really want producers to make profit on a movie after many years of its release? With more cinemas around the country we might be able to solve the problem, but only if they are honest.
With "ignant" statements like this that nah why the disease is still pervasive around the world.
And when I made that statement I also said I why...if they keep doing business as usual. And you didn't remind me of anything...you just keep lying to yourself to make yourself feel good.
If you have read my previous posts on this site you would know that I'm a staunch advocate of cutting ones coat according to your size. Naija producers may not be able to afford the same type of gear they used to make Shuga but that is still not an excuse for releasing the same God awful types of movies they have been releasing for years now. Nobody is saying they should be glossy like Hollywood ...but come on...show some effort...watching some Naija movies is like watching paint dry..
Please read my complete statement before you comment, I never said you couldn't find Bad Boy 2 in the market...I stated that people like to see movies with people like themselves, me included, if a nolly consumer had a choice to pick between a movie like Mirror Boy, Anchor Baby, Figurine or some others like the campus babes movies or the witchcraft or the playboy millionaire that still lives at home with his parents movie, I promise you most times than not they will pick a better produced film. They're selling because that's what is available to them, I'm guilty of doing this too, I go over to my retailer trying to buy a good Naija flick, there are no good one s released on DVD so I settle for the ones I think will be least painful to watch.
Nobody compared Naija to USA...I only used Apple as a business model because they are actually number 1. I'm so tired of this conducive environment excuse,na conducive environment say make we no get a uniform level of sound throughout the movie(basic editing)? na conducive environment cause am make they no fit direct person to act natural? na conducive environment cause am make dem play one song(chinese water torture) throughout a four hour movie? Na conducive environment cause am when dem they give us the same 5 or 6 stories over and over again? abegi stop making excuses for mediocrity...You talked about the laws of supply and demand...how much longer will people keep demanding the product if they're coming to the realization that the product is crap. I have heard a number of people say they would rather buy Ghanian movies these days...cause dem they at least try to improve their industry.....make we dey here day shout say we be number 1...na so Kenya go come overtake us...
I have slowly started to come to that realization too...over the years I have spent close to $1000 dollars on Naija movies, I have a dvd shelf in my basement to prove it, less than 1% of the DVDs in my library is actually re-watchable...I think it's high time i unhooked myself.
Kolinzo, it seems like this is your attitude on every issue, the movies suck, but some people are buying it, so let's fold our arms and not do anything, or I know there's Aids in the world, we can't do anything about it..so let's fold our arms. I think is high time you start living up to your tag line on your posts "get rich or die trying". That "it is what it is mentality just won't cut it.
There is seriously good equipment in Nigeria the problem is almost all Nigerian filmmakers, Producers or whatever they are called are as lazy as hell.
As for the environment not being condusive... why are brilliantly shot films coming out of Iraq and Afghanistan?
Every illiterate Iya Akara, Livinus and Mallam na filmmaker too; no wonder the industry sucks.
instead of using the environment as a negative..filmmakers should be exploiting the environment, do you know how many obodo filmmakers would kill for a chance to shoot a movie in a place like Naija? We have all that scenery outside ...meanwhile 99% of our scenes happen indoors...
We don't value what we have. They can easily make a gritty Nigerian 'City of God'... the nature, colours, culture and vibrancy we have - second to none!
There is one thing to tell African story there is another thing to stigmatize a race of people. You, my friend, are buying the ignorant story. AIDS is everywhere in the world, and for good measures, a glossy mini series is not needed to advertise the message. My God did you watch Shuga? It's as if everybody in Kenya is infested with AIDS. Trust me, a series like that will never see the time of the day on any Major TV in America. Do you think they don't get AIDS in America? But that's another discussion.
There is no reason to make myself feel good about Nollywood. You made an ignorant statement and I reminded you who the numero uno still is, even in KENYA. But i'm glad you've now conceded Kenya is not on our level yet.
Again on the movie access, you can't really tell which of our movies consumers will pick. Figuerine might be considered quality and people might prefer Jenifa, a lower quality movie. Producers are trying to produce better movies but the incentive they get for their effort is nothing to write home about. I just cannot agree with your insinuation that Nigerian producers are daft and can't make quality movies. No man will reject profit, definitely not our Igbo marketers! Man, last year alone we've had more Naija movies shown in the cinema. OUr veteran actors, with some turned producers and directors, have been trying their best to produce better quality movie, but I'm sure even they will tell you hurdle they have to jump to breakeven at least. If the incentive is right you will get better quality movies, trust me.
As for condusive enviroment, no matter how you dice or slice it that is still the main driver. How can you make money in an industry infested with piracy? When there is no money being made from producing a movie how do you pay your editor, sound man, director? When the directors, editors etc are not well paid where is the motivation to do a good job? And that goes for estabished actors too. Why do you think our marketers have developed the habit of producing 4,6, and even 8 parts movies? Is it because they want to make more money or is it because they weren't making more money? I understand your pain as you watch Naija movie, but when you talk about the sound, editing and all that, did you know that the producer of The Figuerine took the movie oversea to professional to master the sound quality? I'm sure it cost him a lot of money to do that. It cost time to edit whether you do it in Naija or overseas, but when the incentives are not there the motivation to do proper editing is in jeopardy. Money dictates all those things you mentioned. I'm sure when the money is right everybody will beef up and move to the next level.
Yeah a number of people do say they prefer Ghanaian movies only to run back to Naija movies after watching two Ghanaian movies. Abegi na we still be number one. Even the Ghanaians can't get enough of Nollywood. Anyway, we will improve when the time is right. It could be now, it could be later. Whatever the case may be keep watching.
You are assuming here. Nobody is saying to talk about AIDS but when you make a mini series to depict a nation as an AIDS infested nation that just doesn't cut it. It's like you are comfortable with Africa being depicted as place infested with AIDS! Sort of like the movies from the past that depicted Africa as being the jungle and Africans had to fight tooth and nail to wipe out that image. And now it's AIDS we have to fight? When is it ever gonna stop! Speaking against stigmatization of Africa is by no means folding arms.
Yeah our movies suck to you...but they say pikin wey no fine hin mama like am. When consumers speak these producers will listen. As fas as I'm concerned the consumers dictate what movies they want to see by speaking with their wallet.