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"Shuga" show from Kenya

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kaymax

Well-Known Member
Wow, all this talk makes me want to do some research and understand the folks behind the camera, here, you're always hearing about great directors in Hollywood like Cameron, Howard, Scorsese, Spielberg, Forster, etc, but now you guys are saying producer/exec. is where the buck starts and stops. OK, gotta go google some stuff.
 

Village-Boi

Well-Known Member
Wow, all this talk makes me want to do some research and understand the folks behind the camera, here, you're always hearing about great directors in Hollywood like Cameron, Howard, Scorsese, Spielberg, Forster, etc, but now you guys are saying producer/exec. is where the buck starts and stops. OK, gotta go google some stuff.
The answer to that is YES and NO. If a studio puts up the money for a film they call ALL the shots and can easily fire a director or producer that doesn't comply... still happens nowadays but not that much. It was a big thing under the 'Studio systeem' of... shall we say 'old'. Now all studios more or less trust the director working on a film they are funding BUT you have to have a track record. It's almost impossible for an 'unknown' director to even get the job. Remeber big difference between an Executive producer (the one that brings the money and generally chomps on cigars in an office) and a Producer (the one that runs around like a headless chicken 'physically' sorting everything out).
The guys you mentioned have mega track records and are huge names - it's rare you'll find a 'studio' that will fuck with such big boys - the audience doesn't give a shit about the studio 'name' but def want to know who the 'director' is... as well as the 'stars'.

Some directors raise the money themselves or with a producer they already know. The buck will generally start and stop there. Then you look at social media - directors sometimes raise money via KickStarter and every Joe that donated a single Dollar is actually an executive producer. A bit more to all of this than just the above but hopefully it gives you an idea.

Having said that the end product is nearly always known as so and so directors film.
 

kaymax

Well-Known Member
The answer to that is YES and NO. If a studio puts up the money for a film they call ALL the shots and can easily fire a director or producer that doesn't comply... still happens nowadays but not that much. It was a big thing under the 'Studio systeem' of... shall we say 'old'. Now all studios more or less trust the director working on a film they are funding BUT you have to have a track record. It's almost impossible for an 'unknown' director to even get the job. Remeber big difference between an Executive producer (the one that brings the money and generally chomps on cigars in an office) and a Producer (the one that runs around like a headless chicken 'physically' sorting everything out).
The guys you mentioned have mega track records and are huge names - it's rare you'll find a 'studio' that will fuck with such big boys - the audience doesn't give a shit about the studio 'name' but def want to know who the 'director' is... as well as the 'stars'.

Some directors raise the money themselves or with a producer they already know. The buck will generally start and stop there. Then you look at social media - directors sometimes raise money via KickStarter and every Joe that donated a single Dollar is actually an executive producer. A bit more to all of this than just the above but hopefully it gives you an idea.

Having said that the end product is nearly always known as so and so directors film.

Ok, so exec. producer is a functional position, while the director and producer are more hands on, right?
 

vince

Well-Known Member
I still think it all comes down to the taste of the person(s) doing the financing. If he really does care, then he won't throw his money at a rubbish team. A marketer throwing 1M at a rubbish team doesn't really care now, does he? If i were a financier for a movie and i am investing a million dollars on the project, i'd make damn sure that my money is well spent by hiring the best team my money can get.
I get your point but it really comes down to finances + the team. A marketer can throw $1M to a rubbish team and get a bad result and a poor marketer can give very little money to a very creative team and get a very good result. This raises a question - Do Nigerians make films because they love film or because they love the money first? It's most probably the latter. I still stand by we're 'generally' too lazy to make good films, to lazy to learn how to even, heck we don't even want to. I once met some guys at BenTV that said they shot their 'feature' film in 2 days... of course it will be kpa, kpa, kpa rubbish. No ifs ot buts about it.

I guess to make a good film one really needs almost everyone involved to be good enough to want to make a good film irrespective of the small or big budget involved.
 

Village-Boi

Well-Known Member
Ok, so exec. producer is a functional position, while the director and producer are more hands on, right?
More or less Yes.

I still think it all comes down to the taste of the person(s) doing the financing. If he really does care, then he won't throw his money at a rubbish team. A marketer throwing 1M at a rubbish team doesn't really care now, does he? If i were a financier for a movie and i am investing a million dollars on the project, i'd make damn sure that my money is well spent by hiring the best team my money can get.
It makes sense but could be different for different cases. For example - a script-reader loves he 1st 10 pages of a script and then decides to read it all. It's very good and he passes it on to his boss who then passes it up the chain until an Exec-Prod gets it and decides to go with it. That would be the 'taste' of the script-reader and the Exec-Prod only tasting how much money he can potentially make here.

I don't really think films get made because of the Exec-producers 'taste'. Shebi even in Naija a marketer will waka enta office, drop 6 milla in cash on the table and say "Make me a film with 3 Hummers in it."He might not know anything about the yet-to-be-written film apart from it will have XYZ cars in it. There are various ways to look at this but general I personally wouldn't say a film is down to the taste of an Executive Producer.
 

vince

Well-Known Member
You are talking Hollywood, bro. I am talking Nollywood here. The chain ain't that long in our Nollywood. You know how things are in naija now. If a marketer sees a good script he knows he can make some good money from, he'd want to shoot the movie as fast as possible to get that profit. We all know what that leads to, don't we? We've been witnessing the result of that for the last decade or more.
More or less Yes.


It makes sense but could be different for different cases. For example - a script-reader loves he 1st 10 pages of a script and then decides to read it all. It's very good and he passes it on to his boss who then passes it up the chain until an Exec-Prod gets it and decides to go with it. That would be the 'taste' of the script-reader and the Exec-Prod only tasting how much money he can potentially make here.

I don't really think films get made because of the Exec-producers 'taste'. Shebi even in Naija a marketer will waka enta office, drop 6 milla in cash on the table and say "Make me a film with 3 Hummers in it."He might not know anything about the yet-to-be-written film apart from it will have XYZ cars in it. There are various ways to look at this but general I personally wouldn't say a film is down to the taste of an Executive Producer.
 

kolinzo

Well-Known Member
Vince that has Mtv written all over it. Haven't you watched Tinsel? That's a Naija production too you know. Besides the video here looks like one of those DJ Tee's videos.

Anyway, I'm watching it and we will come up with something later on.

VB, you think naija fit match the production standard of this show? And i mean that as a TV show and not as a movie. The editing work is 1st class.
 

Village-Boi

Well-Known Member
You are talking Hollywood, bro. I am talking Nollywood here. The chain ain't that long in our Nollywood. You know how things are in naija now. If a marketer sees a good script he knows he can make some good money from, he'd want to shoot the movie as fast as possible to get that profit. We all know what that leads to, don't we? We've been witnessing the result of that for the last decade or more.
Absolutely. That's how things generally happen in Naija and will remain so in a lot of cases until funding comes from 'elsewhere'.
 

kaymax

Well-Known Member
More or less Yes.


It makes sense but could be different for different cases. For example - a script-reader loves he 1st 10 pages of a script and then decides to read it all. It's very good and he passes it on to his boss who then passes it up the chain until an Exec-Prod gets it and decides to go with it. That would be the 'taste' of the script-reader and the Exec-Prod only tasting how much money he can potentially make here.

I don't really think films get made because of the Exec-producers 'taste'. Shebi even in Naija a marketer will waka enta office, drop 6 milla in cash on the table and say "Make me a film with 3 Hummers in it."He might not know anything about the yet-to-be-written film apart from it will have XYZ cars in it. There are various ways to look at this but general I personally wouldn't say a film is down to the taste of an Executive Producer.

10q
 

vince

Well-Known Member
I just saw bits and pieces of Tinsel, kolinzo. I haven't seen it proper.
Vince that has Mtv written all over it. Haven't you watched Tinsel? That's a Naija production too you know. Besides the video here looks like one of those DJ Tee's videos.

Anyway, I'm watching it and we will come up with something later on.
 

kolinzo

Well-Known Member
I disagree. First, Shuga is not a movie. Second, it was shot by Mtv for TV audience. Same can be done in Nigeria if Mtv wants to. Afterall, we have shows like Tinsel which has a high quality production, so Shuga is not such a ground breaking production.

May I also remind you that Kenyans are having difficulties watching their own production? May I also add that Kenyans actually love Nigerian movies more than their movies? May I also and also add that Nollywood is by all means the most sought after movies in Africa? See, we are at least doing something right if other Africans just can't get enough of Nollywood. Just a thought.

It'll take a while before Naija movies get this good....and na partly the Nolly consumers fault, we keep buying what they are selling....all these kpa kpa producers don't have the need to improve the products because regardless of what they put together, people will still buy it.
 

Kala Lou

Well-Known Member
I disagree. First, Shuga is not a movie. Second, it was shot by Mtv for TV audience. Same can be done in Nigeria if Mtv wants to. Afterall, we have shows like Tinsel which has a high quality production, so Shuga is not such a ground breaking production.

May I also remind you that Kenyans are having difficulties watching their own production? May I also add that Kenyans actually love Nigerian movies more than their movies? May I also and also add that Nollywood is by all means the most sought after movies in Africa? See, we are at least doing something right if other Africans just can't get enough of Nollywood. Just a thought.

You may also add , after you're done stroking your schlong, that Nolly movies in most parts are crap. So what if Shuga is a tv show? so what if it was produced by MTV? shouldn't we be striving to do better? Kolinzo stop defending mediocrity....where you not the one who once said we we can't tell our stories the way Hollywood does? Shuga is just an example of artists using western influenced style of production to tell African stories. The industry that you are touting as the greatest in the world is not doing so well these days.....
 

kolinzo

Well-Known Member
My comment on Shuga:

I must applaud the cast and the person who put it together -this is actually what I don't understand about Nollywood! I have said it time without number that we need to feature more new faces (although I have to confess that they are beginning to do that). I want to see a Naija movie full of new faces entirely (yeah...I know I didn't support it in the past but...hey...I think with a good director it's doable). Anyway, back to Shuga. I thoroughly enjoyed it. I mean the actors were very good. The locations were on point. Basically, they paid attention to detail.

But the thing about this kind of mini series is that majority of people won't enjoy it. And by that I mean, if you air a show like Shuga at the same time as say...Super Story by Wale Adenuga for an example, more people will watch Super Story than Shuga. Shuga tends to cater to the so called up scaled. It tends to depict Africa (well, Nairobi) as a place where Aids is killing them left and right. It clearly shows how Mtv is fueling the stereotype that great Africa movie directors have been fighting all this while. Very few of us know about the condition attached to Hollywood/Nollywood collaboration, even Hollywood/anywood collaboration for that matter. Well, you have your answer in Shuga and Tutsi (SA).

Overall, I just love the girls in this mini-series. That Ayira girl, in the very first Episode, is a stunner. Good acting, good production, enjoyable, but not recomended.
 

kolinzo

Well-Known Member
Stroking schlong?! Heheheh...let's leave it at that and just move on to the topic at hand shall we?

What African Story was the show telling? Aids? Because that's what the show is all about.

When you call Nollywood crap, I don't disagree, at least not entirely. In fact these days I have watched more crapollo from Nollywood than I ever did. However, I have also watched very good movies from Nollywood/Nigeria movie industry. What you call crap is golden to a whole lot of Africans who just seem not to get enough. You think I'm lying? Google it. Or better yet join movie sites that show Naija movies and tell us how your Kenyan movie industry is doing. What I'm telling you here is that no movie industry in Africa is better than Nollywood. The sooner you get this fact the better for you.


You may also add , after you're done stroking your schlong, that Nolly movies in most parts are crap. So what if Shuga is a tv show? so what if it was produced by MTV? shouldn't we be striving to do better? Kolinzo stop defending mediocrity....where you not the one who once said we we can't tell our stories the way Hollywood does? Shuga is just an example of artists using western influenced style of production to tell African stories. The industry that you are touting as the greatest in the world is not doing so well these days.....
 

Kala Lou

Well-Known Member
What African Story was the show telling? Aids? Because that's what the show is all about.
Do you know what the Shuga project is about? I hope you know why they commissioned the show.....abi you would rather them talk about witchcraft?
When you call Nollywood crap, I don't disagree, at least not entirely.
I said in most part...I would say less than 1% of Nolly movies really try to put some effort into their movies

What you call crap is golden to a whole lot of Africans who just seem not to get enough.
Just because they keep feeding masses a steady dose of doodoo don't make it golden. A lot of people that watch these movies do not have have access to see well produced movies about their culture. If you give most people an option don't you think they would rather watch a better produced movie or tv show.
Google it.
With as much time an money I've invested in patronizing Nollywood, Google no get anything new whey dem fit teach me, in fact they need to Kalalou me to get more info.
What I'm telling you here is that no movie industry in Africa is better than Nollywood.
Nah brash statements whey you dey make like this dey make me think sey you dey "stroke your schlong" Like USA dey say dem be number one.....

If these Nolly producers are so good at what they are doing, they wouldn't have to make a movie every week to make ends meet....the ones that put some effort into their work don't have to , like the Afolanyas and the Mansos.....
 
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